East Timor's parliament may have rejected it, but the Australian Government insists its proposal to set up a refugee processing centre in East Timor is on track.
Foreign Minister Stephen Smith says the East Timorese government is still open to the idea because the East Timorese parliament's draft resolution was not unanimous. So what now for the proposal to use East Timor as a processing centre for asylum-seekers?
Presenter: Sen Lam
Speakers: James Dunn, former advisor to the U-N mission in East Timor
- Listen:
LAM: Do you agree with Foreign Minister Smith that parliament's vote is not binding?
DUNN: It isn't binding but it's a very strong message and we would do well not to ignore it.
LAM: Well only 34 MPs voted as you know, but to your mind does that reflect the public's view in East Timor? That an offshore asylum seeker processing centre is not welcome there?
DUNN: Well it would reflect, I don't know how widespread the opinions would be, but I think it would reflect them to a large measure. Because as you know, as has been pointed out East Timor below the political surface is still rather unsettled, and there's a general public feeling that things aren't going well, there's a greater distance between the community and the government because the government and of course those involved, the elite as it were, are doing much better, they've been given salary rises and so on, while (for) the ordinary people, conditions haven't changed for them. So I think the test now would be to see what the government comes up with, and if that is rejected by the National Assembly then in fact, I don't think we should go ahead with this.
LAM: Well the 34 MPs who did vote against it, they're from the Prime Minister's party, so who exactly is the Australian government going to be negotiating with, in East Timor?
DUNN: Well some are from the Prime Minister's party, I think others are from the opposition. So I don't... well, they can negotiate with the government, but that's not going to be easy because there is a division between Xanana and Horta. Xanana in a sense is a nationalist, the man who fought, led the resistance and really has had not a lot of international experience.
LAM: This is the Prime Minister Xanana Gusmao?
DUNN: The Prime Minister Xanana Gusmao. Horta on the other hand is the internationalist. That's where he's played a major role, a very effective role and critical role in getting East Timor to where it is now. But then, he is someone who really likes to look at international solutions, he's got strong links with Australia. So I don't think it's right to assume that there's going to be an easy agreement between the two. So this is a tricky issue and for ordinary Timorese what they can't understand is why a rich country like Australia and many of them know a bit about Darwin, they've been over there, they've seen its affluence, they've seen the spaciousness, the great empty spaces around it, why can't they go there? Why do they have to go to East Timor? And one other thing that's very important is that because there has been, particularly in 2006, there was a lot of violence after that, there was quite a long period of instability relating to divisions, the gangs and so on. To bring in another community like the refugees or asylum seekers, could lead to complications.
LAM: Well given that East Timor is such a young country and as you say it has its own host of problems domestically, why do you think the Australian government, and indeed Prime Minister Julia Gillard, why do you think they settled on East Timor as a potential offshore processing centre?
DUNN: Well I suppose maybe, I can't answer that fully of course, but obviously East Timor's close (nearby) and I suppose looking at it, and I'm afraid rather superficially East Timor owes us because we "liberated" them, and of course the answer isn't nearly as simple as that. And I think they thought they could get this across fairly quickly. It's not far away either. I mean if you look at Papua New Guinea it's a matter of moving for example, moving asylum seekers or boatpeople a considerable distance to get them there, and indeed they'd probably have the same problem in Papua New Guinea.
LAM: Do you agree with Foreign Minister Smith's assessment that the issue is still on the table, that it's not a done deal that we won't have it in East Timor?
DUNN: Oh yes I think that is true. I think the government will look at it and if they're confronted with a proposition which is very good for East Timor as they see it, they might go along with it. It has a way to go and it's going to be a fairly tricky route, and the problem in East Timor, is that there is a growing sort of, tension between the National Assembly and the government. And in the past, the government has managed to circumvent National Assembly decisions or attitudes.
